The last Vibrante Royal ever made?

[Steven Watson]

I received this banjo today, which was described in the auction as the last Vibrante Royal ever made. This isn't why I bought it but I'd nevertheless be curious to know if it's true. Perhaps someone here can help? I'd certainly be grateful. The serial number is 5563 285. Inside the case was a print out identifying this number as the last one made (see photos below).

There was also a 1939 letter inside from what looks like F.C. Musselbrook to a Mr Watson. This is of particular interest to me as Watson is my surname too...! I'd be curious to know who he was.

Lastly, and I don't know if this is of interest, but just in case, there were several original unused gut 3rds in the case, labelled 'D'Arblay House / Cammeyer / 10 Poland St. London', as well as two wire 2nds, one red gut 3rd, and some wound strings, possibly silk. There is also a 1935 receipt for a full set of Cammeyer zither banjo strings.

[Jody Stecher]

I misinterpreted. You had mentioned two wire 2nds.  I wrongly assumed the strings in the package photo were those. Obviously I can't count. Not even to 2 :-)

Steven Watson said:

I think there's been some light confusion? I don't think I said they were 2nd strings, and if so I mistyped.

[Steven Watson]

No problem! There were so many strings...

Jody Stecher said:

I misinterpreted. You had mentioned two wire 2nds.  I wrongly assumed the strings in the package photo were those. Obviously I can't count. Not even to 2 :-)

[Joel Hooks]

My day job is operating a small textile mill that operates braiding and knitting machines (think braided cord/rope and shoe lace-- but that is not what we make and I don't want to put everyone to sleep explaining).

Anyway, for measuring round things like strings, extrusions (we do this too), rope, rod, and stuff, Vernier calipers are great because the measuring surface is thin and easy to control.  Micrometers have a flat round measuring surface which can give false readings for long round stuff.  That is my fallacy argumentum ad verecundiam which is worth the pixels that show it on your screen. 

For banjo strings either will work, but I think that people should own Vernier calipers as they measure outside, inside and depth with one tool. 

Vernier calipers are also cheap and the common digital variety will be accurate enough for everyone but machinists. 

Jody Stecher said:

My digital micrometer is precise all the way down to teensy increments like 0.0001 mm.   I used the old "analog" micrometers for decades but they reacted to cold temperature. I had to warm them up before they would give an accurate reading. My limited knowledge suggests that Vernier Calipers are better in some situations than digital calipers but for measuring music strings I prefer a digital micrometer to any kind of calipers. One reason is that any idiot can use them. Even me.

Joel Hooks said:

Best way to measure strings is with Vernier Calipers.  In the US local hardware stores have these, but I think it is a necessary item for a person to own and be able to use. 

Those bridges are the common Zither Banjo pattern.  I am ignorant on the zither banjo, so I cannot speak to the height of bridges, though in the US with regular banjo there is evidence of a trend to use a "high bridge".  This can be seen promoted with the Hartnett Tone Bar.  Later Grover ads include 5/8" tall bridges. 

[Steven Watson]

Doing some digging (with the help of Ian Salter of this parish), I'm pretty sure this banjo originally belonged to a Mr Watson. The letter from Musselbrook found in the case, addressed to Mr Watson, mentions Musselbrook, Watson and Leonard Hussey performing in a trio. Reading through BMG issues from the time confirms that the trio performed on at least a few occasions just before the 2WW.

As to which Watson it is, I'm not so sure. I think the most likely suspect is Samuel Watson — apparently rather a good banjoist — who lived in Surrey and died in 1944 in the war. It would make sense chronologically and geographically, with Samuel Watson definitely playing at both the Croydon and the Hackney and District banjo club at the time. Then immediately after reports of these club meetings, we encounter 'Watson' (no initials given) performing alongside Musselbrook and Hussey at the London Club, and we are told that these meetings included members from the Hackney and District club -- which suggests it's the same Watson. In the receipt for Cammeyer strings found in the case, his initials are given as W. S. Watson (unless I'm misreading this). Perhaps he went by his middle name?

The other curious detail is that the receipt for the zither banjo strings appears to have been written by Cammeyer himself, who signs it 'A.D.C.' The handwriting also appears to match with the writing on the box of bridges, so perhaps both are in Cammeyer's hand. Both also look like the same handwriting as in Cammeyer's letters to Broomfield. The question then is, what might the connection of this Mr Watson be to Cammeyer?

[Joel Hooks]

Very cool story and connection, It will be fantastic for you to give it voice again. 

Regarding connection to Cammeyer?  My guess, Watson bought that stuff from Cammeyer at Cammeyer's "studio" (store).

[Trapdoor2]

Allow me some pedantism as an old machine-shop denizen:

"Vernier" is the type of readout on the calipers. They are "Calipers" and there are 4 common types of readout: Vernier (the oldest), Dial (has a dial with a needle), analog-digital (has numbers geared to the staff) and digital (LED or LCD readout).

All four of these are identical except for the readout type. Typically, they're available in 4", 6", 8"...on up (and their metric equivalents).

Calipers are typically useful for readings in the 0.001" range (regardless of readout). They will direct read to that level. They can be interpolated down to 0.0005" (metric equivalence is a given). True digital ones often readout to 0.0005".

Micrometers are usually an order of magnitude down in range. 0.0001" is typical. A manual micrometer usually features a vernier readout but analog-digital and full digital are now commonplace and may be read to 0.00005".

Micrometers tend to be anvil/spindle specific. That is, the two mating surfaces are called the "anvil" (the lower, fixed one) and the "spindle" (upper, moveable) and there are many job-specific types, such as those for measuring screw threads, soft goods (like fabric or paper), tubing, etc.

Today, inexpensive digital calipers flood the market. To me, they're storage units for dead batteries. I own three sets of dial-type calipers and yes, there's an antique vernier-type around here somewhere.

I would recommend buying a dial-type and from an established manufacturer. Starrett, Brown and Sharpe, Mitutoyo, Fowler all make excellent and reliable calipers. I recently bought a Brown and Sharpe 6" caliper off of ebay for under $100. They're in almost unused condition...and require no batteries.

I now return you to your regularly scheduled banjo madness...

[Jody Stecher]

I would think that all professional and semi-professional zither-banjo and "regular banjo" players who lived and performed within 90 miles of London in 1939 would have known each other. 

Steven Watson said:

The question then is, what might the connection of this Mr Watson be to Cammeyer?

[Joel Hooks]

RE Marc= well, there you go!

I have all types, including the Starrett Vernier (and some good reading glasses).  I usually carry, in my bib coveralls, a pair of Starrett pocket calipers, which are no longer made, and read in both metric and SAE, the old fashioned way.  I keep them waxed or they will rust. 

Dial are fine too-- but my point was, I like the way calipers measure round stuff like strings. 

Anyway, Cammeyer, zither banjos, strings and such. I like it all. 

[Steven Watson]

Just recorded Scheaff's Handel arrangement (possibly not by Handel!) on the Vibrante Royal, with a little semi-improvised prelude...

[Byron Thomas]

That was amazing! Thanks for sharing! I'm loving the sound of the Vibrante. I'm sure it sounds better in person. Are you using the Clifford Essex zither banjo string set with nylon 3rd and 4th strings?

Steven Watson said:

Just recorded Scheaff's Handel arrangement (possibly not by Handel!) on the Vibrante Royal, with a little semi-improvised prelude...

[Steven Watson]

Many thanks Byron! It sounds more powerful and brilliant in person. I do find the louder the instrument, the harder to record... I'm using the Clifford Essex zither banjo set with a gut 3rd.

Byron Thomas said:

That was amazing! Thanks for sharing! I'm loving the sound of the Vibrante. I'm sure it sounds better in person. Are you using the Clifford Essex zither banjo string set with nylon 3rd and 4th strings?

[Richard William Ineson]

I had until recently, a lot of Cammeyer pieces which were stamped with 'W. E. Watson', and the address 68, Falconer Rd. Bushey, Herts. The only pieces I kept from this pile were 'Handy Jack' and 'Danse Bizarre' which I used to play with Paul Whyman in the 1990s. As to Cammeyer strings, Cammeyer certainly sold unwound 3rd wire strings, I still have one or two in their original 'Swallow Street' packets. Cammeyer wire strings were not plated as Cam claimed that the plating affected the tone of the strings adversely. Zither banjo strings, in my limited experience were generally very light gauges, 007 for 1st strings, for instance, and I would think that the 022 gauge 4th strings would be about right, Paul and I used 023 gauge 4th strings, which were all that were readily available at the time. Most banjo strings on offer for the classic banjo these days are far too heavy, in my opinion, one company offering 028 gauge 4th strings which I cannot imagine being capable of producing the characteristic slides which are such a feature of banjo music. I have a Syney Young Vibrante Royale which was made in the 1960s, I believe. The back of the peg head is stamped 'John Alvey Turner' and the number, 108. The heel of the banjo is stamped 'Sydney W. Young', the banjo belonged to Leonard Hussey at one time, he may have been the original owner.

Steven Watson said:

Doing some digging (with the help of Ian Salter of this parish), I'm pretty sure this banjo originally belonged to a Mr Watson. The letter from Musselbrook found in the case, addressed to Mr Watson, mentions Musselbrook, Watson and Leonard Hussey performing in a trio. Reading through BMG issues from the time confirms that the trio performed on at least a few occasions just before the 2WW.

As to which Watson it is, I'm not so sure. I think the most likely suspect is Samuel Watson — apparently rather a good banjoist — who lived in Surrey and died in 1944 in the war. It would make sense chronologically and geographically, with Samuel Watson definitely playing at both the Croydon and the Hackney and District banjo club at the time. Then immediately after reports of these club meetings, we encounter 'Watson' (no initials given) performing alongside Musselbrook and Hussey at the London Club, and we are told that these meetings included members from the Hackney and District club -- which suggests it's the same Watson. In the receipt for Cammeyer strings found in the case, his initials are given as W. S. Watson (unless I'm misreading this). Perhaps he went by his middle name?

The other curious detail is that the receipt for the zither banjo strings appears to have been written by Cammeyer himself, who signs it 'A.D.C.' The handwriting also appears to match with the writing on the box of bridges, so perhaps both are in Cammeyer's hand. Both also look like the same handwriting as in Cammeyer's letters to Broomfield. The question then is, what might the connection of this Mr Watson be to Cammeyer?