Can anyone tell if this is in A notation?

[Austin]

I'm curious because it's a piece by Gershwin that Bela Fleck recorded. The picture is not the best quality (it was taken from Bela's Instagram), but I think I'm seeing an A below middle C. Am I wrong? Gershwin surely would have at least known about A notation because he was American, and he was writing for banjo.

[Austin]

It definitely was technically impressive, but the banjo just isn't a piano. 

Russ Chandler said:

At the risk of being contrarian and at a slight tangent to Austin's OP I thought Bela's recent arrangement of Rhapsody in Blue was an astonishing technical tour de force. One that I was bored with before it got to the end.

Mind you it's better than Eddy Peabodys!

[Jody Stecher]

1) If it is true that Bela does not read music than he would not have had the occasion to be confused by A vs C in notation he did not read. 

2) This would be difficult to play with a plectrum.  It seems more natural with fingers.

3) Not everyone who wrote or writes for 5-string banjo uses the flag symbol

4) Gershwin played with Van Eps. He was not an idiot. He knew about fingerstyle banjo playing and the C tuning Van Eps used

5) Bela is not an idiot either. And not ignorant. Of course he knows about lower tunings. He knows the whole history of the banjo.

[Joel Hooks]

Who claimed Bela was an idiot?

1) "So I write and I keep on writing until it sounds good to me, but I honestly don’t even read music."

https://www.listenmusicculture.com/interviews/bela-fleck

1) "I can’t read scores, and I wasn’t going to suddenly learn how to read music, so I had to do everything with a ‘figure it out for yourself’-type method."

https://banjonews.com/2014-02/interview_with_bela_fleck_part_1.html

It has become a proud point of achievement among popular and successful musicians to not be able to read. 

Recently a singer/fiddle player who also plays a Hartel "minstrel" banjo made a post showing tab (evidently working on a book that will be released soon on "early banjo music").  The post was about her working on "early banjo" pieces, such as Briggs and Converse.  I posted "you are a role model for many people, please promote the original notation for the banjo"

Her reply... "nope! I don't read classical notation on the banjo" and then she said I was insulting people.  Then added that lute music was in tab.   This is someone who attended a conservatory for singing saying that I was "insulting" people for even recommending the concept of reading notation!

So, yeah this is a thing. 

I can't think of another profession that this would work for.  Imagine a structural engineer applying for a job designing bridges "no I can't read or write math, I only build by ear"

Jody Stecher said:

1) If it is true that Bela does not read music than he would not have had the occasion to be confused by A vs C in notation he did not read. 

2) This would be difficult to play with a plectrum.  It seems more natural with fingers.

3) Not everyone who wrote or writes for 5-string banjo uses the flag symbol

4) Gershwin played with Van Eps. He was not an idiot. He knew about fingerstyle banjo playing and the C tuning Van Eps used

5) Bela is not an idiot either. And not ignorant. Of course he knows about lower tunings. He knows the whole history of the banjo.

[Joel Hooks]

Yes, it is certainly a bunch of notes.

Austin said:

It definitely was technically impressive, but the banjo just isn't a piano. 

Russ Chandler said:

At the risk of being contrarian and at a slight tangent to Austin's OP I thought Bela's recent arrangement of Rhapsody in Blue was an astonishing technical tour de force. One that I was bored with before it got to the end.

Mind you it's better than Eddy Peabodys!

[Austin]

Depends on how old the score is. If it's one of Gershwin's first sketches, then there might be a chance that it's in A notation.

Very much doubt that he knows the whole history of the banjo. Seeing as he said the banjo has its roots in bluegrass.

Jody Stecher said:

1) If it is true that Bela does not read music than he would not have had the occasion to be confused by A vs C in notation he did not read. 

2) This would be difficult to play with a plectrum.  It seems more natural with fingers.

3) Not everyone who wrote or writes for 5-string banjo uses the flag symbol

4) Gershwin played with Van Eps. He was not an idiot. He knew about fingerstyle banjo playing and the C tuning Van Eps used

5) Bela is not an idiot either. And not ignorant. Of course he knows about lower tunings. He knows the whole history of the banjo.

[Jody Stecher]

Joel Hooks said:

Who claimed Bela was an idiot?

Austin implied it by presuming Bela did not know about early tunings etc

No need to prove that Bela doesn't read. My point, addressed primarily to Austin, was that if/since he doesn't read the idea that he didn't realize he was looking at "A" notation has no foundation.

[Austin]

Not implying he's an idiot. If he's musically illiterate why would he even bother learning about the difference between c notation and a notation? I don't think he's musically illiterate at all. If he was I don't think he could write two concertos and have them turn out okay.

Jody Stecher said:

Joel Hooks said:

Who claimed Bela was an idiot?

Austin implied it by presuming Bela did not know about early tunings etc

No need to prove that Bela doesn't read. My point, addressed primarily to Austin, was that if/since he doesn't read the idea that he didn't realize he was looking at "A" notation has no foundation.

[Joel Hooks]

Austin, did you miss the quotes from Bela that I posted above?

His words, not mine. 

[Jody Stecher]

Where did this unfortunate conversation take place? You may be dealing with a haughty "stuck up" individual who has no business accusing others of being insulting. However there is a context to the perception common to non-readers that those who suggest reading are looking down upon them.  It has been common for my entire life to find  note readers who think they are superior to ear players. This is outside the world of banjo. And this is in blatant contradiction of the aural evidence. Being able to read gives one access to repertoire. It broadens the mind. It affects how one perceives musical structure. It positively affects the ability to compose. But it does not make one's music sound better. 

Listen to the musically literate lute player Evangelina Moscardi. She's the 8th wonder of the world. She's plays Bach with deep feeling as well as understanding.   Listen to the musically illiterate sarod player Ali Akbar Khan whom the literate Yehudi Menuhin called "the greatest musician of the 20th century" (or words to that effect) and who was held in awe and deep respect by Julian Bream.  His music is deeply affecting and very subtle in the slow sections and highly intelligent in the structure of his compositions. 

Then I could name (but won't) both literate and illiterate whose music is not good to listen to.

Making music, unlike structural engineering does not require literacy.  Music is about the ears, not the eyes. Staff notation is a marvelous storage medium. I am glad I learned to read and write music. But it is a secondary skill, not a primary one. 

One more point: the idea that banjo music should not be rendered in staff notation implies that the banjo is not a musical instrument.  It seems to be rooted in romanticism and the notion of noble savages.  So of course it can be written and read and in some cases it should be. But the page is not the music. The music is what is heard. 

Recently a singer/fiddle player who also plays a Hartel "minstrel" banjo made a post showing tab (evidently working on a book that will be released soon on "early banjo music").  The post was about her working on "early banjo" pieces, such as Briggs and Converse.  I posted "you are a role model for many people, please promote the original notation for the banjo"

Her reply... "nope! I don't read classical notation on the banjo" and then she said I was insulting people.  Then added that lute music was in tab.   This is someone who attended a conservatory for singing saying that I was "insulting" people for even recommending the concept of reading notation!

So, yeah this is a thing. 

I can't think of another profession that this would work for.  Imagine a structural engineer applying for a job designing bridges "no I can't read or write math, I only build by ear"

[Jody Stecher]

Take it from someone who has met Bela Fleck several times: he knows the history of the banjo. He knows about A tuning. Anyway I introduced the idiot idea in relation to Gershwin.  Bela's non-idiot status was gratis. 

Austin said:

Not implying he's an idiot. If he's musically illiterate why would he even bother learning about the difference between c notation and a notation? I don't think he's musically illiterate at all. If he was I don't think he could write two concertos and have them turn out okay.

Jody Stecher said:

Joel Hooks said:

Who claimed Bela was an idiot?

Austin implied it by presuming Bela did not know about early tunings etc

No need to prove that Bela doesn't read. My point, addressed primarily to Austin, was that if/since he doesn't read the idea that he didn't realize he was looking at "A" notation has no foundation.

[Joel Hooks]

She is a "Genius Grant" and gets top billing over Steve Martin. 

She is also filling the role of a "banjo historian", and, in my opinion, if one is a specialist in history then one should be able to read the written language that was used by the subjects being studied. 

[Austin]

You cannot write for orchestra without some understanding of sheet music at least to some degree.

Joel Hooks said:

Austin, did you miss the quotes from Bela that I posted above?

His words, not mine.