The Hazers, AJ Weidt

[david caron]

Hi,

Has anybody else ever attempted this one/recorded the full version of this AJ Weidt piece? I quite enjoy it, but I'm having a hard time with the second half of it. I feel as though I would benefit from hearing an actual recording of it, rather than use the cheesy midi file. 

(Here is a recording of the 1st half (with a few stumbling blocks along the way) but hey, give me a break, I only began learning it this morning :) and its not an easy one)

http://www.free-scores.com/download-sheet-music.php?pdf=89491#

[Jody Stecher]

I haven't played or heard this one before but I might  be able to help if I had more information.

Exactly what is the problem in the second part? Fingering?  Timing?  

Why do you think a recording of a banjo would give you a better sense of the piece than a midi file? (you are one of many who feel that way but I don't understand it. When listening for pitch or phrasing or timing I'm not interested in tone quality)

Why are you using a secondary source instead of the Walter Jacobs 1914 version in the music library here on this Ning site?

Have changes been made?

[david caron]

I am having trouble with the timing.

I consulted the secondary source, just because it happened to come with a midi file (which isn't the case with the version in the music library). I think that both are the same, although an astute observer may find a few slight differences.

I will give it another shot tommorrow and play it very, very slowly.

I prefer hearing live performances because, lets just face it, midi sound files lack personnality.

[Jody Stecher]

I hadn't noticed the midi because the download button was a vague pale orange color on my monitor. I just gave a listen. The phasing of the second part seems clear to me. It's more or less the second part of Muskrat Ramble only with different notes!   The first part is very obscure and I don't think I could learn that part from the midi. Perhaps there is an error.  Of course you are right about the lack of personality in midi. But that is exactly what makes it a useful tool. You don't get the overlay of human interpretation. Instead you get the composer's intention. But that is dependent on the transcription being correct and the midi working properly. 

david caron said:

I am having trouble with the timing.

I consulted the secondary source, just because it happened to come with a midi file (which isn't the case with the version in the music library). I think that both are the same, although an astute observer may find a few slight differences.

I will give it another shot tommorrow and play it very, very slowly.

I prefer hearing live performances because, lets just face it, midi sound files lack personnality.

[Jody Stecher]

Whoops, I meant phrasing, not phasing.

Jody Stecher said:

I hadn't noticed the midi because the download button was a vague pale orange color on my monitor. I just gave a listen. The phasing of the second part seems clear to me. It's more or less the second part of Muskrat Ramble only with different notes!   The first part is very obscure and I don't think I could learn that part from the midi. Perhaps there is an error.  Of course you are right about the lack of personality in midi. But that is exactly what makes it a useful tool. You don't get the overlay of human interpretation. Instead you get the composer's intention. But that is dependent on the transcription being correct and the midi working properly. 

david caron said:

I am having trouble with the timing.

I consulted the secondary source, just because it happened to come with a midi file (which isn't the case with the version in the music library). I think that both are the same, although an astute observer may find a few slight differences.

I will give it another shot tommorrow and play it very, very slowly.

I prefer hearing live performances because, lets just face it, midi sound files lack personnality.

[Joel Hooks]

I don't know if this will help or hurt but I did a read of the 2nd part and recorded the third time I played it on my phone...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bN6X7pvk-od8CjnlvcHEUGJefQMG15gd/v...

I think I get all the notes in place but I did not follow the dynamics and my tempo wavers a bit.

Yeah, Jacobs publications are extremely playable. I would say that Jacobs published some of the clearest and most correct music that came out of the US.  I'm not sure I have found a mistake that I can think of in their music.

Walter Jacobs bought the Gatcomb catalog and reissued a lot of their 1880s and 1890s publications in C notation.  They corrected all the mistakes!  I'd stick with the Jacobs.  

The counterpoint can be tricky if you are not used to reading it.  For example, in the third measure of part B there is a quarter D tied to an eighth D in the next measure with a eighth D (fourth string open) below it.  You even though you hold the tied Ds the full value you would count the quarter D as an eighth note to fit it all in.  Sorry, it is hard to describe.  I think I played it correct so that you can hear it.

Read Grimshaw's explanation on how to read it in his method on page 25 "Accompanied Melody."

[Trapdoor2]

Never attempted it. Cool tune (as always from Weidt). However, I have Tab...and two piano synth mp3 files.

One mp3 is running at 80bpm, the other is more what I would expect for the tune's proper speed, 108bpm...at the bottom of the 'moderato' scale.

I hope these files help!

Speaking of mistakes, I think the very first instance of the 2nd voice (m3 in the intro) is misplaced. It sounds awkward as written. I think the rest should be an 8th note (quaver). The 2nd voice would then come in much like the rest of the piece (where they occur).

[Trapdoor2]

Here's the intro 'as written' and then 'modified'.

The modified version is simply the two notes of the second voice split up. The rest has been reduced by half and then lower note (A) has been moved back in the measure to occupy the second half of the original rest. I like this better.

[david caron]

Thanks everyone. Just one thing.. I noticed that you guys posted around midnight? Don't you guys get some sleep sometimes ? Haha.

 I think that I managed to fix some of my timing issues. I actually prefer the slow version. It reminds me of something that would have been used in an old RPG video game. 

I'm going to keep working on this one. Its a keeper for sure.

[Trapdoor2]

I posted before 10pm local time (US CDT). I gots to have me sleep!

[Joel Hooks]

I was up later than usual, 11 for me.

I don't know Marc, I like the published intro, it gives a slight hesitation at the end that builds excitement-- classic Weidt. I am likely over thinking but I think it is correct.

That said, your interpretation is just as valid and it should be played as the player wants.

I've played through this one in the past but it did not really jump out at me as a must learn.  It is a solid piece.

[david caron]

 I also prefer recordings because I find them to be a bit more motivating. Often times I can relate to the player or tell myself, "ah gee, he/she plays that other song quite well and I can almost play it, at that level, so I know that I can most likely play this one as well."

Jody Stecher said:

Of course you are right about the lack of personality in midi. But that is exactly what makes it a useful tool. You don't get the overlay of human interpretation. Instead you get the composer's intention. But that is dependent on the transcription being correct and the midi working properly. 

[Joel Hooks]

In that case, please accept my apology for the recording, it was not motivating in any way.

david caron said:

 I also prefer recordings because I find them to be a bit more motivating. Often times I can relate to the player or tell myself, "ah gee, he/she plays that other song quite well and I can almost play it, at that level, so I know that I can most likely play this one as well."

Jody Stecher said:

Of course you are right about the lack of personality in midi. But that is exactly what makes it a useful tool. You don't get the overlay of human interpretation. Instead you get the composer's intention. But that is dependent on the transcription being correct and the midi working properly.