Opinions on how to play this measure.

[IAN SALTER]

This request is just out of curiosity, but if anyone has a moment to comment, I would appreciate it. 

The first bar of the B part of Frolic Jig.

I'm not working up the tune, but whenever I'm playing through the book and get to this tune, I always wonder how others would tackle that particular measure. I think there are four possible fingerings and having practiced all of them, there is one that is now starting to flow at an increased tempo. It would be interesting to see what advanced players think.

Thanks,

Ian.

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[IAN SALTER]

I must stress that I don't have an academic background and only use the term in the most basic sense. As far as I'm concerned for the banjo, it started with an original instrument, gut and silk wound strings, original texts and some imagination. Within the documented history of the genre, I just wish I could find accounts of vernacular use of the instrument, which considering how many were supposed to have been produced and purchased, appear to be scarce, to say the least. And because it was mentioned, this also applies to the harmonica, but to a greater extent, as there were millions of them purchased by ordinary people. 

[Austin]

If you want a good way to practice this particular movement,from the fourth to the F shape, Grimshaw's first exercise in how to excel on the banjo practices it.

[Jody Stecher]

Yes, at 88 bpm which is slow.  At that metronome setting the Frolic Jig would be viable if a bit sedate.. The chord in the Grimshaw exercise would occur at the same time as the C in the first half of the measure in question in the Frolic Jig. The player would have to get to the A in half that time.  In the second half of the measure the notes FCA are a triplet. The player needs to get to the A even sooner. The high F at the end of that measure occurs at the same time as the F chord in the Grimshaw exercise. Basically the measure in the Grimshaw exercise  is played at one half and one quarter the speed of the Frolic Jig measure. 

Austin said:

If you want a good way to practice this particular movement,from the fourth to the F shape, Grimshaw's first exercise in how to excel on the banjo practices it.

[IAN SALTER]

Hi Austin,

Thank you for that suggestion. I haven't looked at any of that particular method book, although I do know it is highly recommended by a number of members here. Moving from the low F to the F shape often occurs in tunes and particularly in the accompaniment parts for Second Banjo and through much practice, I have no problems with it. However, as Jody has just highlighted, it is the addition of the triplet and how to execute it precisely at an increased tempo, that was the problem for me, as I hadn't encountered that particular phrase before. 

[Austin]

88 BPM seems slow but you have to remember it's in 16th notes in 2/4 so it's slow but rapid.

[Austin]

I don't know if Rob McKillop even plays it up to the tempo and he adds tons of rubato when getting to that position shift. You can almost feel it stop for a split second. Not that Rob is the end-all be-all of classic banjo technique, but he's a competent player at the very least.

[Austin]

Sorry for all the messages, but I would also like to add that there is no tempo marking, so how do you know how fast it's meant to be?

[Jody Stecher]

I know from the printed tempo marking.

[IAN SALTER]

If you're asking how I know how fast to play 'Frolic Jig' as it doesn't have a metronome marking, then I can't give you a single or simple answer. As is applicable to any piece that I work on, the tempo will gradually increase as I become familiar with the tune, overcome any 'tricky bits' and then memorise it. Along the way I will break the tune down into various sections and play around with them, experimenting with different phrasing, dynamics and tempos. At some point, I would expect to be able to play the entire tune in a number of different ways and in regards to tempo, from extremely slowly to as fast as I possibility can. As I'm only playing for my own enjoyment, I don't have to settle on a specific tempo, but having played my fiddle for dancing over the last thirty years, I tend to settle on the tempos I would use for jigs, hornpipes, schottiches, polkas, reels, waltzes etc. I've never really considered tempo as a metronome mark, so I can't comment on that.

I can't find any recording of Rob playing the Grimshaw exercises.

[Jody Stecher]

OH!  Austin, did you mean how does one know how fast to play the Frolic Jig?  I thought you meant the Grimshaw exercise.

My answer to that question :  one knows from the title, genre, and species, so to speak. "Jig" in this 19th century banjo  context means a lively dance and a musical composition to which the lively dance is danced.   This kind of "jig" is in duple time, it's not the 6/8 double jig or 9/8 slip  jigs of Ireland or Scotland.  The word "frolic" as a verb means to move about with happy excited energy. As a noun it has meant a dance event. Then there is the context: the context in which this written music is found; the other repertoire in the collection.   Finally there is the shape and substance of the melody itself. Taken together we can assume this is meant to be lively music.

Anyway my point is that at dance speed it is hard to play the triplet well moving from fret 5 on string to the lower frets and the standard 5 chord shape. For me it flows better using the frets and fingers I described.  

[Richard William Ineson]

As there are thousands of tunes written/arranged to be played on the banjo, and  this piece doesn't strike me was being particularly distinguished in any way, why not move on to another tune which doesn't present such seemingly unsurmountable technical difficulties, and forget about this one?

[Trapdoor2]

Tempo is whatever you want. I felt comfortable playing "Frolic Jig" at 90bpm, FWIW. 100 felt rushed.

The F sequence in question: I have no trouble playing the F (at the 5th fret, 4th string) with my ring finger and then jumping quickly to a 213 grip. Easier in the dotted bit but the triplet just wants a tiny bit of practice to smooth it out.

Also, like Richard, I would probably just pass it up. Not worth the time and effort for me.