Conversation moved from Comment Wall

[Jody Stecher]

Jake,

First of all thank you for disagreeing in such an agreeable manner. Such behavior is in short supply these days.

I'm aware of the 19th century American instruments that had some features of what is now called zither-banjo. But these were made in small numbers and were not called zither-banjos either.  We have been through all of this in earlier threads in which Joel Hooks made it clear that Cammeyer included the material of the strings (3 types) in his definition of what comprises a zither-banjo.

Yes the worst sounding zb-s with all steel are the cheapo models. But they do sound better when strung  with a mixed set as described.  And better quality zither-banjos sound *much* better when strung with a *mixed* set. I think it likely that you have studied zither-banjo history more thoroughly than I have. But tell me, have you ever seen a manufactured set of all steel strings that were designated on the packages as intended for zither-banjo?  This was a widely popular instrument. Surely if all steel were anything but an anomaly such sets would exist. 

Let us agree to disagree about what comprises good tone. 

Please  post your comments in the usual place. The method for doing this is to go to the home page and click where it says to click to post a new discussion. It's not complicated.  It makes it possible for people to follow a conversation coherently.

the above is a response to the following which was on the hard-to-access Comment Wall

At 19:37 on January 22, 2025, Jake Glanville said…

Sorry, Jody, I must correct you about zither-banjos not being made in the USA.  They were.  They simply wern't usually called that in the USA.  Have a look at George Teed 1862, Benjamin Boardley (usually wrongly refered to as 'Bradley') around 1882, and Todd & Douglas about 1880.

Also I disagree strongly about zither-banjos 'sounding awful' with steel strings.  If a zither-banjo sounds bad there's usually a good reason i.e. a 'cheapo', maltreatment, improper set-up, etc.  The most common reason however, is that people simply don't know how to play 'em, and unfortunately that applies particularly to people to people on your side of the Atlantic (I exclude from these comments all Americans who know how to get a good sound out of a ZB, and there are one or two, i.e. Guy Wolfe -sorry if I've mispelled, who's both American and brilliant).

Best Wishes,

BJ. 

[IAN SALTER]

Hi Jody and Jake,

I have already mentioned this in an earlier thread, but it seems relevant to this discussion; Ellis describes strings for the zither banjo on pages 3 and 4 of his 'Champion Tutor'. The date of publication is not shown, but I think it likely to have been quite early in his career.

I have chosen to use wire strings for 5th, 1st, 2nd & 3rd, with a wound silk 4th on my W E Temlett 'Apollo n°1'. I really like the way it sounds, but it is certainly different to what, I think it's fair to say, we have become accustomed to hearing on recordings of Cammeyer's music. That is more than likely because I play it exactly as I do my ordinary banjos, unlike my Wilmshurst with a gut 3rd, to which I apply a little more finesse.

[Jody Stecher]

What does he say in his description? 

IAN SALTER said:

Hi Jody and Jake,

I have already mentioned this in an earlier thread, but it seems relevant to this discussion; Ellis describes strings for the zither banjo on pages 3 and 4 of his 'Champion Tutor'. The date of publication is not shown, but I think it likely to have been quite early in his career.

[Jody Stecher]

OK, I found the tutor on the Internet Archive. He describes the stringing you use on your Apollo.  I have found gut is the best for third string and the next best is nylgut in its old formulation (not the recent versions).  Nylon is a poor third and maybe steel would be better.

Jody Stecher said:

What does he say in his description? 

IAN SALTER said:

Hi Jody and Jake,

I have already mentioned this in an earlier thread, but it seems relevant to this discussion; Ellis describes strings for the zither banjo on pages 3 and 4 of his 'Champion Tutor'. The date of publication is not shown, but I think it likely to have been quite early in his career.

[IAN SALTER]

Jody,

I apologise for not providing the link to the Internet Archive. I had forgotten it was there and not in the tutor books section.