A question about the value of Clifford Essex Paragon 5-string banjos

I am trying to understand why the Paragon 5 string banjo usually sells for a lower price than what Clifford Essex considered to be lower models. I understand the economics and history of why Paragon tenors go for more than the five-string  specimens so I'm not asking about that. The context of my question: a friend has inherited a number of nice string instruments. Amongst them is a CE Paragon in fine condition. It had been played regularly for many decades, was well cared for, and always and only strung with nylon strings. She has more instruments than it is practical to keep so she is trying to determine the value of each to help her decide what to sell. Some are easily researched but this one is an anomaly.  The XX Special or Concert Grand regularly sells for about $2200 USD whereas Paragons go for substantially less. I have never seen one for sale for more than $1800.  I may be wrong but it seems to me that there are more available XX Specials than there are Paragons. One would think the relative rarity would increase the value. The sound and response and playability of these two models is of course different from each other and although I wouldn't call the Paragon "better" even though it sold for more when new, I wouldn't call it "worse" these days.    Can anyone explain the situation to me?  thank you.

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CE Concert Grands sell regularly for $2200!?!

In the UK and Australia all the ones I've seen for the past 10 years or so have sold for the equivalent, yes. There are 2 right now on the John Alvey Turner website. One is for that amount the other is less but it has a cracked resonator and doesn't have all the paperwork etc that the other has.  

Asking and getting are two different things.  Classic era banjos were selling for more 10 years ago.  That market is significantly lower right now.

As far as selling v asking...

An auction that ended recently...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CLIFFORD-ESSEX-034-PONY-034-BANJO-/11426...


What appears to be the very same banjo on the JAT website (with an appropriate retail mark up).

https://johnalveyturner.co.uk/5-string-banjos-open-back-and-zither/...



Joel Hooks said:

Asking and getting are two different things. 

TRUER WORDS WERE NEVER SPOKE

Classic era banjos were selling for more 10 years ago.  That market is significantly lower right now.

I'M TEMPTED TO INFER AN ANSWER TO MY PARAGON QUESTION FROM THAT. BUT IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY PARAGONS WERE SELLING FOR LESS THAN XX SPECIALS  15 YEARS AGO AS WELL.

I've only played one Paragon.  It was certainly well crafted but it was very brittle sounding to me (and remember-- I love Van Eps banjos). 

The offer at the time was sub $2k (maybe closer to $1500 but I don't remember-- heck, it could have been lower that that).

It did not do much for me.  I think the value would be in the rim for a tenor conversion.  It was okay but I did not need to own it.  

I got my CE Concert Grand for about $700.  It is in very good condition and has the resonator (still usable), the tailpiece cover, and the payment book with tax stamps.  I think I paid a little much for it but I don't regret it. 

Any time you want to sell your Concert Grand I'll give you $1k :-)
Joel Hooks said:

I've only played one Paragon.  It was certainly well crafted but it was very brittle sounding to me (and remember-- I love Van Eps banjos). 

The offer at the time was sub $2k (maybe closer to $1500 but I don't remember-- heck, it could have been lower that that).

It did not do much for me.  I think the value would be in the rim for a tenor conversion.  It was okay but I did not need to own it.  

I got my CE Concert Grand for about $700.  It is in very good condition and has the resonator (still usable), the tailpiece cover, and the payment book with tax stamps.  I think I paid a little much for it but I don't regret it. 

I'll keep that offer in mind if I decide I need to reduce my library.  This one is in regular rotation of playing so I am not ready to pass it on yet.

I was only half serious but no less than half. I already have an XX Special. I have had it strung with nylon and with steel. I found that with nylon it's an excellent banjo but with steel it's fantastic. This is a surprise because most models of all brands of banjos that I have played are always better (to my taste of course) with nylon (or other soft strings) than with wire strings. They are not only better but louder too. Of course the Metal Only crowd refuse to believe this but I'm one of those oddballs who give credence to empirical evidence. 

Anyway it would be great to have one always strung with nylon. Is this idea a symptom of excess or of banjo acquisition syndrome?  Probably.  On the other hand it has been 5 or 6 years since I bought a banjo so......

Joel Hooks said:

I'll keep that offer in mind if I decide I need to reduce my library.  This one is in regular rotation of playing so I am not ready to pass it on yet.

Five or six years without buying a banjo - that is good going!  I have a six month itch.  

I think decent banjos are just more expensive here in the UK.  Yes, the Paragon would appeal to someone wanting to covert it to a tenor banjo (they are highly prized by Irish tenor banjo players).  The bluegrass players still prefer the mastertone-style banjo while clawhammer banjoists are wanting scoops and a woody, mellow sound - more marimba than banjo to my ears - hopefully that means more vintage banjos for us!

But I did buy 2 ouds and 1 mandolin in that period.  Sigh, I would hate to see this banjo converted to a tenor. The Paragon fetish in Irish banjo exceeds the irrational longings for flathead tone rings in the bluegrass world.

It all started with Barney McKenna, a good player and a heck of a nice guy, who through his presence in the internationally popular band The Dubliners, brought attention to the Clifford Essex Paragon tenor banjo. Or more precisely he brought attention to what the Paragon looked like. Because inside his banjo was a non-Essex tone ring. And now everyone wants a Paragon so they can.... what? Look like Barney McKenna?  

By the way I spent some time playing mandolin and guitar with Barney and I could not help noticing that his technique was nonsensical, awkward and "wrong" and it mattered not a bit because he sounded fabulous. There is no such thing as a Regulation Hand in size or shape and no Regulation Mind either. He played in a way that worked for him and for his audience. 

carrie horgan said:

Five or six years without buying a banjo - that is good going!  I have a six month itch.  

I think decent banjos are just more expensive here in the UK.  Yes, the Paragon would appeal to someone wanting to covert it to a tenor banjo (they are highly prized by Irish tenor banjo players).  The bluegrass players still prefer the mastertone-style banjo while clawhammer banjoists are wanting scoops and a woody, mellow sound - more marimba than banjo to my ears - hopefully that means more vintage banjos for us!

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